alternative hippopotamus

Compare and Contrast: Accountability Edition

6 Responses to “Compare and Contrast: Accountability Edition”

1. KCinDC Says:
   October 15th, 2007 at 7:00 pm

   I agree. But I don’t accept the theory of some of the pro-impeachment folks in the article that Pelosi is refusing to impeach because having Bush in office is good for the Democrats. Even if impeachment were on the table, removing Bush from office is about as likely as Bush naming Al Gore as UN ambassador. The Republicans in Congress have demonstrated repeatedly that they don’t care about any of Bush’s crimes. These are new, improved Republicans, lacking principles or any sense of shame — not like the ones from the Nixon era. There is zero chance that 17 Republican senators (and Lieberman counts as a Republican for this situation) will vote to remove Bush from office.

   More likely is that Democrats believe that the public won’t like the impeachment process itself. I think they’re wrong about that, but I do worry about whether Bush being “vindicated” (as Republicans and the media will describe it) by being impeached but not removed from office could send a worse message than taking no action at all. I go back and forth on that point.

2. AltHippo Says:
   October 15th, 2007 at 9:12 pm

   As you and I have discussed, these Republicans are indeed a new breed. It’s as you put it: “These are new, improved Republicans, lacking principles or any sense of shame — not like the ones from the Nixon era. There is zero chance that 17 Republican senators (and Lieberman counts as a Republican for this situation) will vote to remove Bush from office.”

   That’s how I see it, too.

   And it could be that at some point, one of the new Republicans realized that there’s not much you can do outside of impeachment to check the power of the Executive. Given that the effect of impeachment proceedings is unpredictable, and could even make Bush less radioactive, it’s not surprising that the Democratic majority would play it safe.

   Here’s the problem: the lesson of the Nixon era is that no one is above the law. Not even the president. If there is no accountability for warrant-less wiretapping, politicizing the Justice Department, extraordinary rendition, etc., then the lesson is a dramatic reversal of lessons learned: the president becomes the modern equivalent of a king.

   Now, it may be that Pelosi understands this. I don’t see anything in her written words or actions that tells me she takes this seriously.

3. Jamelle Says:
   October 15th, 2007 at 9:15 pm

   I tend to lean towards initiating impeachment proceedings for the simple reason that they provide a reason to air out the crimes of the Bush Administration. I do have the same worry as KCinDC though, if Bush weren’t convicted then there is the chance that the press will portray him as having been vindicated.

   If I were feeling less charitable, I’d suggest that Pelosi is reluctant to pursue impeachment (particularly for abuses of executive power) because she doesn’t want those powers off-limits to a Democratic president.

4. AltHippo Says:
   October 15th, 2007 at 9:49 pm

   Jamelle,

   I was editing my comment as you posted, so my apologies if that changes the form or substance of what you posted.

   I certainly hope that Pelosi (and Reid) aren’t angling to do the same things in a Democratic administration. That’s not why there’s a Democratic majority right now.

   I’ve lost a good deal of faith in the press, unfortunately. KCinDC suggests that a Senate vote against impeachment would result in the press vindicating Bush. At this point, if Bush successfully digested a pretzel, I’m afraid the press would see this as vindication. While that’s a bit of exaggeration, I’ll bet Chris Matthews would approvingly show a clip of Bush downing an entire pretzel.

5. Jamelle Says:
   October 16th, 2007 at 10:11 pm

   AltHippo,

   Unfortunately, I’m no where near hopeful that the Democratic leadership is actually opposed to the methods of Bush’s “War on Terror.”

   The main reason why I fear a Hillary Clinton presidency is the fact that there is every indication that she will hold onto the powers that Bush and Cheney have accrued for the presidency.

6. AltHippo Says:
   October 16th, 2007 at 11:00 pm

   Will Hillary embrace the powers that Bush and Cheney have accrued for the presidency?

   That’s a damned good question.

   I’m trying to come up with someone who has followed her career closely enough to answer that.

   The closest thing I’ve seen is Bob Woodward’s “Shadow, Five Presidents and the Legacy of Watergate.” His portrayal of Hillary Clinton is sympathetic, but he does liken her to Nixon in terms of secrecy and paranoia. In all fairness, she has good reasons to be paranoid.

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